The apolytikion of St Mary Magdalene will be chanted this coming Sunday (July 22). If anyone has the means to record this piece as it is sung at the Patriarchal Cathedral of St George, I would be quite interested in hearing it.
"Joseph was amazed" (Κατεπλαγή Ιωσήφ) - Soft Chromatic vs. Nenano
- Thread starter GabrielCremeens
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The apolytikion of St Mary Magdalene will be chanted this coming Sunday (July 22). If anyone has the means to record this piece as it is sung at the Patriarchal Cathedral of St George, I would be quite interested in hearing it.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
This is perhaps a little late to be of use to anyone, but I did a little searching and discovered this score by Stanitsas which has the music for the hymn Χορός Αγγελικός, a somewhat obscure prosomion practically identical to Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ. I set the words to St. Mary Magdalene's apolytikion to this score; perhaps I'll upload it later. I figured that, since Χορός Αγγελικός and Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ were basically the same hymn, the diatonic version of Χορός Αγγελικός should be acceptable to use for apolytikia set to the melody of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
-Gabriel
-Gabriel
romanos4
Παλαιό Μέλος
That's my understanding as well - and I wonder if some of the reasoning behind the diatonic version is someone practical and quite simply that the Theotokion of the Mode (Tou Gabrieel...) is also diatonic and thus no need to repitch.
-Ross
neoklis
Νεοκλής Λευκόπουλος, Γενικός Συντονιστής
"Χορός Αγγελικός," is not prosomion but aytomelon, not at all identical to "Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ". It is chanted in the first mode (diatonic), as Stanitsas has it. You can follow this discussion.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
Sorry - should have clarified. When I say "practically identical", I mean metrically, in terms of the metering of the syllables. That is, a melody of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ, which is (usually) chromatic, can be chanted to the "tune" of Χορός Αγγελικός, which is diatonic.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
Then maybe you could direct me to a score for the diatonic, "apolytikion" version of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ? I've been looking for it for a while, and can't seem to find anything.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
From what my teacher, Dr. Karanos, has told me, ALL apolytikia in first mode are diatonic, and, similarly, ALL apolytikia in fourth mode are soft chromatic - without exception. Hence, there is no Theos Kyrios in soft chromatic first mode (for Τον Τάφον Σου Σωτήρ) and no Theos Kyrios in nenano (for Η Αμνάς Σου Ιησού). That is, if you're chanting "God is the Lord", an apolytikion, and a Theotokion, and they are all in the same mode, there should be no break or change between the three hymns, in terms of modal variants. (If I recall correctly what he told me.)
The only exception I can think of would be the Saturday of the Akathist, when we chant (I don't remember exactly - I believe Το προσταχθέν) Theos Kyrios in triphonos plagal fourth, but then switch to Ni for the apolytikion that follows.
neoklis
Νεοκλής Λευκόπουλος, Γενικός Συντονιστής
There is no "apolytikion" version of "Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ". It is a "kathisma" chanted in soft chromatic scale, as do all prosomoia that follow its melody.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
As discussed in earlier posts in this thread, this does not necessarily seem to always be the case, perhaps depending upon schools of chanting and local traditions. This is mentioned, for instance, by Prof. Makris, when he says that,
This is what I'm basing my comments on, and also and the reason for my request/search for music for the "apolytikion" (i.e. diatonic) version of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ.
I am aware that yes, in some places, the soft chromatic "kathisma" version of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ is used as the basis, even when a hymn is actually chanted as an apolytikion. This is how Papa Ephraim writes it in his Apolytikia and Kontakia for the Entire Year book. This is also how I remember hearing it at the metochion of Simonopetra in Thessaloniki, and also at Simonopetra itself, when I was there last November. However, as mentioned by Prof. Makris above, by my own teacher, Dr. Karanos, and also by Dr. Giannoukakis, I believe, in previous posts (unless I misunderstood him), there is a diatonic version of Τον τάφον Σου, Σωτήρ, which serves as the model melody for apolytikia composed according to this paradigm (e.g. the apolytikion of St. Mary Magdalene, whom we celebrated yesterday.)
-Gabriel
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neoklis
Νεοκλής Λευκόπουλος, Γενικός Συντονιστής
Have you ever heard it chanted this way, or seen music notation of it?
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
Personally, no, I haven't, although I trust what I have been told by others, as I mentioned in my previous post.
neoklis
Νεοκλής Λευκόπουλος, Γενικός Συντονιστής
If you can, ask and post the reply. I personally have my doubts.
GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
neoklis
Νεοκλής Λευκόπουλος, Γενικός Συντονιστής
... I have been asking, in the previous five or six posts...
I mean personally, by email, phone etc. If you have the opportunity.
Nikolaos Giannoukakis
Παλαιό Μέλος
Dear Gabriel,
If you want to compose the music to an apolytikion that, in the original Greek, is preceded by the statement "Ton Tafon sou Swthr", in the absence of any specific music, I would follow the "Xoros Aggelikos" (as you provided in the Stanitsas interpretation) as the basis.
As we have all discussed in this thread, the melodies for the Apolytikia are distinct from the melodies of the Kathismata (for which established templates exist).
This is an anomaly and there are some hypotheses as to its basis. For the time being, notwithstanding the WHY, it would be in line with tradition to compose based on existing music for the APOLYTIKION aytomelon "Xoros Aggelikos". It really is the only thing we have in our knowledge base.
NG
If you want to compose the music to an apolytikion that, in the original Greek, is preceded by the statement "Ton Tafon sou Swthr", in the absence of any specific music, I would follow the "Xoros Aggelikos" (as you provided in the Stanitsas interpretation) as the basis.
As we have all discussed in this thread, the melodies for the Apolytikia are distinct from the melodies of the Kathismata (for which established templates exist).
This is an anomaly and there are some hypotheses as to its basis. For the time being, notwithstanding the WHY, it would be in line with tradition to compose based on existing music for the APOLYTIKION aytomelon "Xoros Aggelikos". It really is the only thing we have in our knowledge base.
NG