GabrielCremeens
Music Director at St. George, Albuquerque, NM
Christ is risen!
I hope this finds everyone well. I've been trying to compose some scores recently, and I've encountered several questions or issues over the past couple months that I've been unable to resolve.
1) When it comes to Greek names that have been transliterated into English, how should we determine the accentuation and pronunciation of these names? I've encountered this question for names like:
-Theodosius
-Nazarius
-Protasius
-Eudocia
-Pelagia
For instance, is Theodosius 4 syllables or 5? ("The-o-do-si-us" or "The-o-do-sius") The same question applies to the other two names - in other words, do we treat the "ius" ending in English (transliterated from the Greek ιος) as one syllable or two? This applies to the names "Eudocia" and "Pelagia" as well - do we separate the "i" from the "a", or do we elide them?
Related to these same names: how do we determine where the accent should fall? Knowing Greek, my instinct is to simply pronounce these names in English, but retaining the Greek accentuation. However, only someone who knows Greek would even think to pronounce "Eudocia" as "Ev-tho-ki-a" - rather, I believe that most native English speakers with little/no exposure to Greek would say "Eu-do-sha".
2) This question probably deserves a second topic, but since we only view one active topic per forum at a time from the main forum page of Psaltologion, I'm afraid it might get buried. My question is this: how do we determine if a formula is being used incorrectly or perhaps "stretched" a bit?
For instance, in the Plagal 4th Hard Chromatic Slow Doxology of Grigorios Protopsaltis, we encounter the line Πατερ Παντοκρατορ in the 3rd verse of the doxology. (I've attached a picture of this verse.)
As far as I can recall, I have only seen one other instance where the petaste of this thesis (the "kylisma", or whatever you want to call it) takes a new syllable - in this case - the "το" of Παντοκρατωρ. The other time I saw something similar was in Papa Ephraim's slow aposticha of first mode vespers - again, I have attached a picture.
Another instance is in the Aposticha doxastikon of St. Dionysius the Areopagite, found on p. 25 of the old Mousiki Kypseli. (The piece is in fourth mode sticheraric.) I have attached a picture. In the second-to-last line of the piece, we see the phrase πιστώς δοξάζομεν. On this particular thesis, I don't recall if I have ever seen the second oligon and kentemata take a new syllable.
A final instance of a thesis perhaps being "stretched" is in the Axion Estin of Theodoros Phokaevs in Varys Enharmonic mode from low zo-flat. In the third line of the piece, the words την Θεοτόκον are placed on a thesis that I have never seen take a new syllable in that particular area. Specifically, it is (as far as I can remember) always written with syneches elaphron-kentemata, all over an oligon. Here, however, the "kentemata" take a new syllable, so they must be written as an oligon, and the normal "support oligon" removed. A picture is attached.
I guess my question is: how should we regard these formulas? Are they legitimate? Can we use them in compositions? Are they legitimate, given that all they are all written by very great composers - but perhaps should be avoided, since they seem a little unusual?
Or perhaps there are other instances like the ones I've listed above, which I simply am not aware of or have not noticed?
In Christ,
Gabriel
I hope this finds everyone well. I've been trying to compose some scores recently, and I've encountered several questions or issues over the past couple months that I've been unable to resolve.
1) When it comes to Greek names that have been transliterated into English, how should we determine the accentuation and pronunciation of these names? I've encountered this question for names like:
-Theodosius
-Nazarius
-Protasius
-Eudocia
-Pelagia
For instance, is Theodosius 4 syllables or 5? ("The-o-do-si-us" or "The-o-do-sius") The same question applies to the other two names - in other words, do we treat the "ius" ending in English (transliterated from the Greek ιος) as one syllable or two? This applies to the names "Eudocia" and "Pelagia" as well - do we separate the "i" from the "a", or do we elide them?
Related to these same names: how do we determine where the accent should fall? Knowing Greek, my instinct is to simply pronounce these names in English, but retaining the Greek accentuation. However, only someone who knows Greek would even think to pronounce "Eudocia" as "Ev-tho-ki-a" - rather, I believe that most native English speakers with little/no exposure to Greek would say "Eu-do-sha".
2) This question probably deserves a second topic, but since we only view one active topic per forum at a time from the main forum page of Psaltologion, I'm afraid it might get buried. My question is this: how do we determine if a formula is being used incorrectly or perhaps "stretched" a bit?
For instance, in the Plagal 4th Hard Chromatic Slow Doxology of Grigorios Protopsaltis, we encounter the line Πατερ Παντοκρατορ in the 3rd verse of the doxology. (I've attached a picture of this verse.)
As far as I can recall, I have only seen one other instance where the petaste of this thesis (the "kylisma", or whatever you want to call it) takes a new syllable - in this case - the "το" of Παντοκρατωρ. The other time I saw something similar was in Papa Ephraim's slow aposticha of first mode vespers - again, I have attached a picture.
Another instance is in the Aposticha doxastikon of St. Dionysius the Areopagite, found on p. 25 of the old Mousiki Kypseli. (The piece is in fourth mode sticheraric.) I have attached a picture. In the second-to-last line of the piece, we see the phrase πιστώς δοξάζομεν. On this particular thesis, I don't recall if I have ever seen the second oligon and kentemata take a new syllable.
A final instance of a thesis perhaps being "stretched" is in the Axion Estin of Theodoros Phokaevs in Varys Enharmonic mode from low zo-flat. In the third line of the piece, the words την Θεοτόκον are placed on a thesis that I have never seen take a new syllable in that particular area. Specifically, it is (as far as I can remember) always written with syneches elaphron-kentemata, all over an oligon. Here, however, the "kentemata" take a new syllable, so they must be written as an oligon, and the normal "support oligon" removed. A picture is attached.
I guess my question is: how should we regard these formulas? Are they legitimate? Can we use them in compositions? Are they legitimate, given that all they are all written by very great composers - but perhaps should be avoided, since they seem a little unusual?
Or perhaps there are other instances like the ones I've listed above, which I simply am not aware of or have not noticed?
In Christ,
Gabriel